mr2-digest Monday, January 5 1998 Volume 02 : Number 064 Re: MR2 O2sensor RE: MR2 OVERDRIVE MR2 Re: mkii convertable MR2 Re: Top Speed Re: MR2:MKI Top Speed MR2 MKII package MR2 Clutch Problem Need Answers!! RE: MR2 - MK1 Problems with Emmisions Re: MR2 Dwell meter: what is it? Re: MR2 Clutch Problem Need Answers!! Re: MR2 MK2 Convertabile,MK1 timing belt questions? MR2 MKI NA top speed. Re: MR2 - MK1 Problems with Emmisions MR2 hello from down under Re: Need a Lug Nut for 91 MR2 Re: MR2:MKI Top Speed ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:39:21 EST From: Sport Ridr Subject: Re: MR2 O2sensor In a message dated 98-01-04 22:08:01 EST, you write: << Besides the fact that the $29 unit is a one wire unit and does not have the preheater it should be fine for several years. If you live in a smog test world make sure you run your car hard before smog testing. >> I live in florida where we dont have inspections. Almost every car ive owned i have removed the cat. converter. There are MANY muffler shops that do this here. Mike Craig 86 MR2 http://members.aol.com/SportRidr/intro.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:48:46 -0500 From: "Daniel Wetherbee" Subject: RE: MR2 OVERDRIVE >I have an '86 model mr2 with all the toys (automatic,a/c, leather, sunroof, >etc). I seem to be having a problem with the transmission not shifting into >overdrive. It will eventually shift but it takes about fifteen to twenty >minutes before it does so. Is this a common problem? Barry, I'm in Denver, Colorado, USA, and bought an '86 automatic three months ago. In the mornings it usually takes 10 to 15 minutes before it starts shifting into overdrive, but the heater starts working right away (great heater!) The temperature gauge is always at the same place when it starts shifting into overdrive. Now let me ask you and other "Mrs. Two" (Automatic Transmission) owners if any of you have experienced problems with manually downshifting when the engine is cold? When cold, mine will sporadically fail to downshift when I pull it into "2". When I pull it into "1" it will downshift into second gear, but NOT to first. As it warms up a little, it will shift into first if I pull it into "1" HARD, clear to the back. Also with cruise control engaged, it will drop out of overdrive, and often never shift back up into overdrive (obviously, after it has warmed up). Are these symptoms of anything that I should be concerned about or take action over? Also, in following the "top speed" thread, I am very disappointed that my rig tops out under 110mph (closer to 105mph). 97,000 miles, NA, snow tires, 85 Octane, mile-high altitude, no modifications. That pretty much excludes me from entertaining ideas of running the "Silver State Classic", which, as a novice, sounds incredibly enticing. I love owning and driving this car, but in following the postings, somehow feel like we owners of automatics aren't driving the same quick vehicle as everyone else. Especially off the line. Dan Wetherbee > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 08:55:57 +0000 From: Tony McDaid Subject: MR2 Re: mkii convertable X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <199801050636.AAA03232@slapshot.hockey.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-2022-jp Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > whats the "deal" with these? >From what I remember, it was just a "one off", and the manufacturer was either Yokohama, (yes the tire guys) or another company, I am not too sure. It was made by TRD. I 'think' you can still buy them over here. Later Tony McDaid tony@akina.ne.jp http://www.akina.ne.jp/~tony/ `89 MkII Turbo T-Bar ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:32:34 EST From: Sport Ridr Subject: MR2 Re: Top Speed In a message dated 98-01-04 21:22:00 EST, you write: << Mike It is good to see that you are not the only one who has had there MK1 over the supposedly top speed of 122. A friend of mine also had a 86 and we had it up to 140+ on more than one occasion, but of course when I said that to the group they slammed me hard, saying that it couldn't be done if the car was stock. As far as my friend knew it was stock. I was in the car with him when we did it. Man that was a great car. Well hopefully you don't get slammed, but you most likely won't with the mods you have done. I now have a 88Na (automatic) but will have a 5-speed also sooner than later I hope. My friend who is also on the list has a 87(automatic), he bought it wrecked cheap or he wouldn't have a bought a auto. Well good luck to you. Your sight is pretty nice also. The tunes were very nice. >> I forgot to mention that when my mr2 was stock, it would easily do over 120mph, even 130 for that matter. Thanks. p.s. ive worked hard on my web page joe, and i am allways changing/adding things. Mike Craig 86 mr2 http://members.aol.com/SportRidr/intro.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 19:08:27 EST From: FZZR Subject: Re: MR2:MKI Top Speed Mike, I think you totally missed the point of what we where saying. You said you where doing what 137MPH at 5700rpm. That is what is not possible. You can't run 137MPH at 5700 RPM on the stock gearing in a MK!. You said you compared your speedo to a motorcycle. A zx7r. Good God motorcycles are the worst when it comes to speedometers being way way off. I mean you can never never trust a motorcycle speedometer anywhere past 100MPH. No one is putting down your car. I am sure it is killer and is faster than a stock MK1. The point of all this is you can NEVER trust the stock speedometer. ****************************************************** Chuck FZZR@AOL.COM 88 MR2 SC (150,000 miles) 89 Yamaha FZR 1000 (40,000 miles) ******************************************************** In a message dated 98-01-05 19:00:26 EST, you write: << I have 15" wheels and 205/50/15's for tires, After i put the wheels on, i was worried that the speedo was gonna be a little slow, so i had my friend ride along side me on his 97 ZX-7R Kawazaki, and i tested 35, 45, 55, 60, 65, 70, 85, 100, and 135 mph speeds, and the mph indicated on my car compared to the 2 month old bike showed that my speedo was indicating the correct speeds, but for 35 and 45 mph, my speedo indicated 1 or 2 mph faster than i was really going. All other speeds were on the money correct. Plus, my MR2 mkI is NOT stock. I have changed the intake a bit for better air flow to the throttle body and the MAF and the exhaust has a high flow muffler, and NO cat. converter. This will increase top end. I dont know how fast a totally stock MKI is but i know that mine alot faster than my buddies, and his is also an 86 except his has no intake/exhaust mods. Maybe one afternoon we will both go out in our MR2's along with my other friend on his ZX-7R and top out the cars. I have definately had mine up to 135-140mph about three times now. Sometime this week i guess im gonna have to take it out to a rual area, bring the rpm's up to 7000, and take a picture, and scan it, to prove to the doubters what MY top speed is, that way there are NO arguments! Mike freakin Craig 140+MPH 86 MR-2 MKI >> ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:29:51 -0600 From: "Chris King" Subject: MR2 MKII package I have a question for all you gurus out there or at least someone with a 91/92 brochure. I have come across a mr2 for sale that has the following as told to me by the dealer: 91 turbo leather t-tops aftermarket power windows My question is this: Was there a package where you could get the leather, t-tops, etc and not have power windows? My guess would have been that the power windows would have come standard with one of these. So I am curious why this car would supposedly have "aftermarket" power toys. Any thoughts always welcomed... Chris K. 91 NA ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 18:43:45 -0600 From: toyotamr2@juno.com (Guess Who) Subject: MR2 Clutch Problem Need Answers!! Well i finally pulled the tranny and got the clutch out of my 85 Mr2.. The thing is that the clutch is not even at minimum specification. So it doesnt make sense why it was slipping so bad when i was coming down a hill by my house, i was going so slow i had to pull over. as soon as i got out of the car i went behind the car to where the tranny is but didnt smell anything. The only reason i did this is when the clutch went on my 85 Ford Escort which had 130,000 on the orginal cluch i could smell it, but i didnt smell anything. so i figured i would be able to go, got back into the car pushed the clutch down and go it into gear let out it just slipped and i went no where. There seems to be no wear on the pressure plate, a little but nothing major. So what could be wrong, by the way the car only has 109,000 miles on the orginal clutch, i am going to replace the clutch and throw out bearing, but should i replace the pressure plate?? is this what might be causing this?? Also i dont want this to just happen right away again, since the orginal clutch had another 35,000-45,000 miles worth of wear left.. But its not worth it to but it back together and then have to do it again in that amount of time. I would like to solve this little problem. Thanks Joe 85 Blue Mr2 Http://www.netcom.com/~Mr2boy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 19:46:53 -0500 From: Chris Conlon Subject: RE: MR2 - MK1 Problems with Emmisions Jason wrote: > >> > >----Original Message----- > >> Did your test have results for carbon monoxide/CO and nitrogen oxides? It > >> would > >> really help to make a diagnosis, if available. > > Driving Idle High Idle > HC(ppm) 1175 400 450 > (MAX) 300 350 300 > > etc... You may have to get Ron to give a more authoritative answer; but til he chimes in I will take a stab at it. In some kind of order: How many miles on the wires? If they're stock or any carbon-type, they may be worn out after 30k-60k miles, depending on who you listen to. How did you test them? A simple ohmmeter test can easily pass wires that are too old to be of much use. Distributor cap & rotor, again, how many miles on them? Pull and check for signs of wear. Check the ignition timing, but unless it's way out I doubt that's it. What's your tailpipe look like? Sooty black, maybe even a bit wet? > Plugs are fine... Do the plugs all look the same? I had a miss once and #3 was visibly different from the other 3, suggesting distributor cap or rotor or plug wires. You could have a leaky injector, but my guess is you don't. Hopefully that'd show up on your plugs, and maybe in your gas mileage? A bottle of injector cleaner and some high speed driving probably can't hurt, but will it help??? I'm guessing your O2 sensor & cat are basically ok, just there's no way the cat can handle all the HCs if you have a consistent miss. NO seems high as well, you mentioned exhaust/EGR problems, right? This is beyond me, maybe those leaks could cause these readings but I don't know. That's my $0.02. Ron? What do you think? Chris C. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 19:13:38 -0600 From: "Steve Hoult" Subject: Re: MR2 Dwell meter: what is it? >Whats a dwell meter and how do I use one to tune my car? It checks the length of time the points are held open. As you can tell from the short explanation, it's not really applicable to an electronic ignition system. Steve Hoult '89 SC ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jan 1998 20:45:47 -0500 From: Stephen Gunter Subject: Re: MR2 Clutch Problem Need Answers!! At 06:43 PM 1/5/98 -0600, Guess Who wrote: >Well i finally pulled the tranny and got the clutch out of my 85 Mr2.. >The thing is that the clutch is not even at minimum specification. So it >doesnt make sense why it was slipping so bad when i was coming down a >hill by my house, Yes it does...if the pressure plate is also worn the clutch will slip..it's not the clutch also that wears... i was going so slow i had to pull over. as soon as i >got out of the car i went behind the car to where the tranny is but didnt >smell anything. The only reason i did this is when the clutch went on my >85 Ford Escort which had 130,000 on the orginal cluch i could smell it, >but i didnt smell anything. so i figured i would be able to go, got back >into the car pushed the clutch down and go it into gear let out it just >slipped and i went no where. There seems to be no wear on the pressure >plate, a little but nothing major. So what could be wrong, by the way the >car only has 109,000 miles on the orginal clutch, Only? it all depends on how the car was driven during those miles... i am going to replace >the clutch and throw out bearing, but should i replace the pressure >plate?? Absolutely, they should always be replaced together...and drain the fluid as well. is this what might be causing this?? Also i dont want this to >just happen right away again, since the orginal clutch had another >35,000-45,000 miles worth of wear left.. But its not worth it to but it >back together and then have to do it again in that amount of time. I >would like to solve this little problem. Thanks > >Joe >85 Blue Mr2 >Http://www.netcom.com/~Mr2boy > Stephen Gunter,1990 Levin, icq 285675 http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/7177 home of the Toyota Mods WebRing ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 21:13:57 EST From: Ltraviolnc Subject: Re: MR2 MK2 Convertabile,MK1 timing belt questions? In a message dated 98-01-05 17:35:34 EST, locaencabeza@hotmail.com writes: > lso, I'm getting the timing belt changed in my 87 MR2. What > other than changing all the other belts should I have done and is > $150.00 a good deal to have the timing belt changed? > Well, I figure about $30 to $40 (list) for the belt and around 3 hours for labor at an average of about $35 to $40 per hour. So yeah, thats about right. Ron 87/\/\R2 Ltraviolnc@aol.com ICQ '98: 3087083 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 20:20:06 -0800 From: "David Hawkins" Subject: MR2 MKI NA top speed. > I have had my MKI na to 137mph @ 5,700rpm's I'm sure to get flamed for this, but.....since the MKI NA topped out at 116mph@6350rpm, I think your next mod should be an accurate speedometer. Without forced induction, or a TON of NA mods, you will never see that speed in a MKI NA. And if you are running stock size tires, you wouldn't see it at that low of an RPM if you were indeed hitting it. My 93T hit 137 (once, probably never again) in Montana a couple of years ago and it was turning 6200RPM. David H. otgrouch@twosrus.com 93T FIPK/RMS S.P/RMS MBC 89SC Cupholder 66 Corvair 96 Cannondale R900 Spinergy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 21:06:51 EST From: Ltraviolnc Subject: Re: MR2 - MK1 Problems with Emmisions In a message dated 98-01-05 20:19:29 EST, synchris@ricochet.net writes: > > Driving Idle High Idle > > HC(ppm) 1175 400 450 > > (MAX) 300 350 300 > > > > etc... > > You may have to get Ron to give a more authoritative answer; but til he > chimes in I will take a stab at it. In some kind of order: > > How many miles on the wires? If they're stock or any carbon-type, they may > be worn out after 30k-60k miles, depending on who you listen to. How did > you test them? A simple ohmmeter test can easily pass wires that are too > old to be of much use. > > Distributor cap & rotor, again, how many miles on them? Pull and check for > signs of wear. > > Check the ignition timing, but unless it's way out I doubt that's it. > > What's your tailpipe look like? Sooty black, maybe even a bit wet? > > > Plugs are fine... > > Do the plugs all look the same? I had a miss once and #3 was visibly > different > from the other 3, suggesting distributor cap or rotor or plug wires. > > You could have a leaky injector, but my guess is you don't. Hopefully that'd > show up on your plugs, and maybe in your gas mileage? A bottle of injector > cleaner and some high speed driving probably can't hurt, but will it help??? > > I'm guessing your O2 sensor & cat are basically ok, just there's no way > the cat can handle all the HCs if you have a consistent miss. > > NO seems high as well, you mentioned exhaust/EGR problems, right? This is > beyond me, maybe those leaks could cause these readings but I don't know. > > That's my $0.02. Ron? What do you think? > > Chris C. Hmm, I really wish I remembered all the stuff I used to know when I was doing IM testing....but it's been about 8 years and things get a little fuzzy...you'd never know that I got a 97 on my IM exam! Also, in PA we only test at idle (for now...), so I never got too much into off-idle readings as I've never had a way to see them. I must say though, that our idle limits are alot lower for that year at 220ppm (HC) and 1.2 (CO). There is definitly something not right here, though because your HC's are way up across the board and REALLY high at "driving" when I think they should be at or near their lowest. Geez, I just wish I could remember the relashionship of a high HC and low CO reading, because I know you can use that in a possible diagnosis or at least to eliminate some things. I again agree with Chris to carefully check all the regular tune up stuff and at least eliminate the obvious. My car was running on the rich side before I changed the O2 sensor, and if you have over 60 to 70k on yours, I'd suggest changing it (I got Bosch direct replacement for under $50 with the proper connecter and bolt flange from Western Auto). 4A's seem to be very sensitive to proper ignition timing, so thats worth a look, too. Also, don't forget the air filter (I don't remember if you mentioned that). hmm...what else...make sure the pcv tube is'nt clogged....The EGR system could come into play here, but should'nt affect the levels at idle. Eeesh, brainfade! Well, I'll let you know if I think of anything else. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 15:37:09 +1300 From: Adrienne Mora Subject: MR2 hello from down under hi all : ) I've popped in for a visit ... are all you ol' ones still around??? : ) ade ade@mr2.org.nz ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 21:44:45 -0400 From: bagdon@rust.net (S and K Bagdon) Subject: Re: Need a Lug Nut for 91 MR2 How do you loose a lugnut? :) BTW, I don't have one, but you should specify front or rear (they are different sizes). Steve B. >Does anyone have a spare lug nut for a 91 MR2? I lost one of mine. > >Thanks, > >Scott McBurney ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 1998 21:45:11 -0400 From: bagdon@rust.net (S and K Bagdon) Subject: Re: MR2:MKI Top Speed >I have 15" wheels and 205/50/15's for tires, This should have a relatively close total diameter as stock 185/60-14 (give or take an inch, but nothing outrageous). > After i put the wheels on, i was >worried that the speedo was gonna be a little slow, so i had my friend ride >along side me on his 97 ZX-7R Kawazaki, and i tested 35, 45, 55, 60, 65, 70, >85, 100, and 135 mph speeds, and the mph indicated on my car compared to the 2 >month old bike showed that my speedo was indicating the correct speeds, but >for 35 and 45 mph, my speedo indicated 1 or 2 mph faster than i was really >going. All other speeds were on the money correct. Has the bike's speedo ever been calibrated? If not, then you don't really now your actual speed. > Plus, my MR2 mkI is NOT >stock. I have changed the intake a bit for better air flow to the throttle >body and the MAF and the exhaust has a high flow muffler, and NO cat. >converter. This will increase top end. I dont know how fast a totally stock >MKI is but i know that mine alot faster than my buddies, and his is also an 86 >except his has no intake/exhaust mods. Doesn't matter how fast your car is - gearing and tire diameter will dictate top speed. You can have a 1/4 time of 11sec and 115mph, and then you'll be reaching top speed at the 1/2 mile mark. > Maybe one afternoon we will both go out >in our MR2's along with my other friend on his ZX-7R and top out the cars. I >have definately had mine up to 135-140mph about three times now. Sometime this >week i guess im gonna have to take it out to a rual area, bring the rpm's up >to 7000, and take a picture, and scan it, to prove to the doubters what MY top >speed is, that way there are NO arguments! Hey, I never diagreed with your indicated speed, I disagreed with your actual speed. Unless you've gotten real handy with swapping Paseo gear sets into your MR2, and are running 17" 50-series tires, redline is about 124-126mph. If agreeing with you that your indicated speed is 140mph, hey, more power too you. But you're only going 125 actual speed... >Mike freakin Craig >140+MPH 86 MR-2 MKI John Welch, will you *please* step in here. Thanks. Steve B. ------------------------------ End of mr2-digest V2 #64