mr2-digest Saturday, January 3 1998 Volume 02 : Number 055 MR2 MKII Turbo - MSD Ignition Questions. Re: MR2 Top Speed Re: MR2 Coolant and other maintenance issues Re: MR2 MKII: Heater Re: MR2 Mk1 leaky windows Re: MR2 MKII-T 91/92 vs. 93 Re: MR2 Top Speed Re: MR2 MK1 rim width MR2 MKII T clutch (or lack thereof) MR2 Mr2 parts Vaguely MR2 Related - HELP! Re: MR2 Simco Re-Chipping MR2 Your new engine Re: MR2 Assistance Needed With Oil Leak MR2 Exotic Fuel for "The Beast" Re: MR2 mki distributor o-ring Re: MR2 Mk1 potentiometer and thanks! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 3 Jan 1998 20:03:51 -0800 From: SAMAIL@webtv.net (SCOTT MAGNESS) Subject: MR2 MKII Turbo - MSD Ignition Questions. Hi all, I've just purchased an MSD ignition control (model 6A) and their Blaster 2 coil for my 93T. My questions are: 1. Are the stock plug wires good enough? If not, what make and size would be good to use? 2. MSD do not recommend any particular plug design, heat range or gap. Should I use platinum tips? spifires? Regular plugs? What gap between 0.050" - 0.060" works best? Already using K&N FPIK, Trust exhaust and EVC set at 1 bar. If this makes any difference to my questions. Thanks for any help. Scott M. 93T ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Jan 1998 23:09:38 EST From: FZZR Subject: Re: MR2 Top Speed In a message dated 98-01-03 16:21:43 EST, you write: << I've done 130 and the car was still accelerating strongly. Just looking for a ballpark. The Classic is rated in classes up to Unlimited (over 180). I'm curious where I might fit. I think the car will make 140, maybe more. Steve >> Just don't forget that the speed class you enter will be your avg speed. So if you top out at say 145mph you will have to take into acount what speed you will be running through the curvy parts. ****************************************************** Chuck FZZR@AOL.COM 88 MR2 SC (150,000 miles) 89 Yamaha FZR 1000 (40,000 miles) ******************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Jan 1998 23:12:20 EST From: Daucott Subject: Re: MR2 Coolant and other maintenance issues Don't forget about the engine compartment air bleed valve!! Dave A. daucott@aol.com > Steve N. says that he has trouble getting all the air out of the cooling > system and is following the service manual. Steve, you mention leaving the > cap on 1 click and running the car for 3 minutes, then re-opening the cap > only to have coolant rush out. Sounds to me like you won't get anywhere > bleeding the air that way. The idea is to bleed air out of the system from > the furthest points (similar in principal to bleeding brake hydraulic > systems). Those points are the valves located in the front of the car with > the plastic hoses attached to them held high in the air. Unfortunately, > this is a rather messy and time consuming job. I have done my cooling > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Jan 1998 21:13:58 -0600 From: "Andrew P. Tasi" Subject: Re: MR2 MKII: Heater - -----Original Message----- >How can I check whether my MR2 has a heater? I had tried push it all the >way to the right (red indicator) and it still giving me cold air. I >bought it few months ago and not sure whether it comes with a heater. Don't worry-they all come with a heater. >Would it be a problem and the A/C? Probably not. Here's what I'd check: - -First check the coolant level and add if neccesary. - -If this doesn't do it, replace the thermostat. If it's stuck open, your car will never completely warm up, your heater will seem less than adequate, and your fuel economy will likely be lower than it should be. If you'd like to work on your MR2 yourself, buy a BGB-Toyota "Big Green Book" factory repair manual. >Thanks for your advise. > >Regards, >iVan >91 Red 3SGE 51000km Good luck and I hope this helps, Andrew P. Tasi Black '88 MR2 T-top ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Jan 1998 23:05:42 EST From: Daucott Subject: Re: MR2 Mk1 leaky windows In a message dated 97-12-29 01:37:12 EST, omalley@texas.net writes: > I am trying to adjust the windows on my 87MKI to stop whistling when I drive > above 50 mph. The door glass does not seem to contact the rubber seal at the > Does this make sense to anyone? Hi. It's been a while for the window thread!! You can adjust the windows in/out and up/down and tilt easily once you remove the door trim panel. There are adjustment bolts/nuts on the window control mechanism (the window regulator) that will move it in or out, and you can loosen the glass and move it up/down/tilt at the bottom connections to the window regulator. It's really pretty easy, but will take a while to "tweak" into perfect silence, if ever. Dave A. daucott@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Jan 1998 23:15:35 EST From: Daucott Subject: Re: MR2 MKII-T 91/92 vs. 93 In a message dated 97-12-29 08:59:52 EST, cutajar@ibm.net writes: > The only way to verify this for certain is with a Dyno. However, I think > you're chasing wild geese here. The 3SGTE engine was not changed between > 92/93, at least no changes that I've ever heard or read about. The one I might add that my stock '93T kicked the crap out of Steve B's stock '91T by nearly 25 rear wheel hp. State of tune is critical and could account for the differences, not to mention the fact that some engines just produce more power than others, even off the same assy line. Dave A. daucott@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Jan 1998 23:18:06 EST From: FZZR Subject: Re: MR2 Top Speed In a message dated 98-01-03 20:44:38 EST, you write: << How long might you have to maintain this speed/boost? >> The silver state challenge normally last 90 minutes or so. (obviously less if you go faster) ****************************************************** Chuck FZZR@AOL.COM 88 MR2 SC (150,000 miles) 89 Yamaha FZR 1000 (40,000 miles) ******************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Jan 1998 23:59:33 EST From: Daucott Subject: Re: MR2 MK1 rim width In a message dated 97-12-29 12:49:13 EST, asanders@law.tulane.edu writes: > Thinking of putting 15x7's all around. Will I have any problems with > front clearance, as long as I go with the recommended 205's rear and > 195's front? Or can I go wider? I'm stuffing 225/50s on 14x7 with 42mm offset under my MK1 on both ends for autocross. The car is lowered and it JUST fits. This is with Hoosiers, BTW, which are HUGE tires, so any regular brand shoud fit OK. Dave A. daucott@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 20:54:45 -0800 From: Matt Gawlowski Subject: MR2 MKII T clutch (or lack thereof) Yes, after a very long abscence, I have rejoined the mr2 digest community! Unfortunately, it is tragedy which has brought me back, though not with my MR2, but a friend's. We'll be working on it first thing tomorrow morning, and she REALLY needs the car working ASAP if at all possible, hence the use of the 'announce'...sorry! The car: '93 Turbo, 60k miles The problem: NO CLUTCH. Engagement point so low to floor as to be questionable - may not even BE an engagement point anymore. Pumping the pedal has no effect, and there's very little pedal resistance. Preceeding events: Weeks ago, a 'thunk' was felt as clutch pedal depressed. Since then, the engagement point has become lower and lower in the pedal travel...accompanied by a softer thunk usually. Now, nothing. In the past few weeks, the car has seemed to be harder to get into gear, but that probably means nothing (IMO). She drove the car to her place tonight w/o a clutch; managed to get the car into THIRD gear, and reported lots of smoke as the engine lugged around virtually zero rpm. Yes, I know, I know, but don't yell at me, this wasn't *MY* idea, I didn't know about it until she called me when she got home! I DO own the factory service manuals, but they aren't too enlightening w.r.t. this problem. Possibilities: Pedal linkage???? Master cylinder (but how do you explain the thunk?)??? Slave cylinder (not likely)??? Other ideas? My plan: inspect linkage and adjustment mechanisms. Test output of master cylinder. Pray that someone on the digest has gone through this already...! Please, any comments? Thanks in advance, - - Matt G., '91 White NA, whitemr2@worldnet.att.net http://www.geocities.com/~gawlowski ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 23:10:46 -0800 From: Steve N Subject: MR2 Mr2 parts Saw this part on the rebuildable car site: TOYOTA MR2, 4 AGE, 16 valve, needs rings, head & intake manifold in good condition, $50. (860) 485-1780. Harwinton Anybody feel like getting a 4age to work on? Steve N. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 21:15:04 PST From: "Sean Boileau" Subject: Vaguely MR2 Related - HELP! Hello all, Trouble with my AM/FM/CD Changer - my left passenger door speaker is acting funny (strange not ha ha). Sometimes it's perfect, sometimes it's silent, sometimes it's scratchy as all hell. Any thoughts before I spend $$$ pointlessly? It's not the speaker itself, I switched it with no change... Sean 91 NA ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Jan 1998 00:12:28 EST From: Daucott Subject: Re: MR2 Simco Re-Chipping In a message dated 97-12-29 19:31:56 EST, abulkh34@matrix.newpaltz.edu writes: > This rebuild gave me an increase in low end power, but I still have the dip > that you mentioned is gone on your car with the Simco re-chipping, and I > would like even more power. I don't trust Superchips at all from all we've > heard about them on the list, and I don't see any other company, even in the > US, doing anything similar to Simco. I'd like to know how much the unit Hi again. I was just in Orlando and stopped by Superchips shop to get the info on the ICON for the MR2. They now have a programmable ICON that interests me.... you can start with the "Superchips" program and tweak from there. It costs $400 for the programmable one and $300 for the non programmable one. However, they only change timing... no fuel adjustments. I've also contacted GForce in California, the guys who did the SCC turbo, and they can and will do the early MR2 NA cars but have only done "90% of the boss' Corrolla" so it would be a bit of an experiment, and costs $725. The benefit here is they will put in a programmable chip and actually change fuel, timing, rev limit, TVIS point, whatever, much like the GEMS system at a lower cost. I'm still investigating more options... I'll post when I figure out what I'm gonna do. And, of course, there will be dyno results posted eventually. Dave A. daucott@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Jan 1998 21:34:10 -0800 (PST) From: momosc@sasquatch.com Subject: MR2 Your new engine Hi Paul In Japan they still use the 4A-GZE in a FWD Corolla called a Levin. The engine in current form makes 165hp and 151 ft/lbs of torque bone stock. It uses a smaller SC pulley for 10lbs of boost, and runs a higher CR (8.9:1 vs 8:10). Also the ECU system is MAP sensor based as opposed to AFM. This has been so since 1990 or so. Around Sydney, Aus there is a group of importers who specialize in Japanese performance stuff. Through one of them I am importing the front end of one of these Levins. It will cost me about $2500 US to get it landed here. I would imagine that I'll be up around $6000 by the time I'm done with everything includine a balance and blueprint and further mods on the new engine. I dont recommend going this route cuz $6000 will buy you the nicest MK1 SC in the world, but it is a labor of love for me and I enjoy the challenge. As far as having driven the Nazca C2 Spyder, yes I drove it over Laureles Grade with Fabrizio Giugiaro (Giorgetto's son, and the designer of the Nazca) in the passenger seat. I've also got a fair amount of seat time in F-40s and assorted other Ferraris and Lamborghinis. I sold them for 10 years then evolved into doing journalism for various exotic and vintage racing magazines like Cavallino, Prancing Horse and Victory Lane. Mo ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Jan 1998 00:33:18 EST From: Daucott Subject: Re: MR2 Assistance Needed With Oil Leak In a message dated 97-12-30 12:10:31 EST, jcotton@pernet.net writes: > I bought a '85 a couple of months ago for my son, soon to be a driver > (watch-out SE Texas!). It had been sitting for 5+ years. After pulling the > fuel tank to replace the fuel pump we found just about everything else to > work... Shortly there after we found that we had a bad head gasket and went > on to replace that (found the exhaust manifold to be cracked at the #4 > John, the most common oil leaks are from the cam covers, distributor body, distributor o-ring at the head, the o-rings between each of the oil filter housing pieces (there are two), and the oil cooler lines which you already checked. Since you say it's all over the A/C compressor, look closely at the distributor (oil inside it or on the heat shield) and from the o-ring where it enters the block. Dave A. daucott@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Jan 1998 00:37:16 EST From: Ace123JIM Subject: MR2 Exotic Fuel for "The Beast" Jeffrey, Thanks for the suggestions. I appreciate all the comments and ideas from our members (the collective "brain trust") The idea here is to produce lots of power, without destroying the engine. Understanding that almost no instrument can react fast enough to provide enough warning during a high boost run, my initial solution was to take preventive measures to protect the engine. Let's look at the ideas presented. a. Advanced timing: Alamo did the initial timing advances on the dyno. They felt that the engine would benefit from the advance. The car pulls stronger off the line and has better low rpm performance advanced. They set it at 14 deg BTDC and I pulled it back to 12 after the sensor problem. b. Colder plugs: I am running two steps colder non-resistor Autolites now. They seem to have good color and the engine pulls as clean and smooth as it possibly could. c. Compression: I am not concerned with the head gasket yet. I was thinking about putting in forged pistons, but I would like to know how the stock cast pistons will hold up. We will never know the answer on the project car because of their problem with the fuel pump. As you know I am trying to avoid their fate by the use of a Supra intank pump and Greddy Rebic 3 with additional injectors. I have considered going to a thicker metal gasket to lower compression, but I don't want to pull the head until I need to do it for better reasons. When the head is off, there are many things I want to do to it. Many of these changes need to be worked together. I like many of the things SCC has done with their car, such as the ceramic coatings. I also have a budget and have to make changes a little at a time. d. Better Intercooler: Better intercooling is something I am always interested in. I have the Greddy now. During a run, say against a Corvette :) , the car is at max boost for only seconds. Then it spends the rest of its life easing around town with hardly any load at all. It's only during those seconds that I am working to keep things together. But, it's also during those seconds that the knock sensor broke. I may have still had some of that "great" FINA fuel in the tank from the night before, when Kerry was sleeping at 3:15 am and I was down to the last gallon of fuel and the only open station was 100 mi back in MS and I didn't stop because it was not Amoco. The FINA at the all night truck stop began to look mighty good. That may have been the real reason for the problem. But when you tune with 108 octane, you have a problem when you only have access to 93. I like the trunk mounted intercoolers, but again this would involve major work. Many of the installs in HyperRev have redone the intake, some to feed from the trunk side. I looked at the liquid intercooler while I was at Alamo. I like the short plumbing runs and the efficiency of this unit. I want to see what it does for the project car before I look further. Jeff Hartman(SCC project) is my R&D man and after a slow start he seems to be headed in a positive direction ;) e. EGT's: Let's talk about the EGT. I don't see many of them on cars. I am not sure what information a single probe EGT will give us that will help us make decisions about the car. I use one in the Helicopter and in fixed wing airplanes to set the mixture. This makes for up for altitude and provides a lower fuel burn. The EGT reacts quicker than a CHT (cyl head temp) and allows us to fine tune the mixture. A four probe EGT would tell us if we had one hot cyl, but it is a usually a comparison of all 4. For me, it's sort of a relative measure. Four probe units that show all four at the same time cost a small fortune. I guess my question is, what do we want it to tell us and why? In an airplane the engine is running at a nearly constant rpm, so the EGT will produce a rather steady temp as a relative measure to use for leaning the engine. In our cars it's up and down the rpm range, and at constant highway speeds(70-75 mph) where the EGT might give a consistent reading, the turbo is doing very little. By the time the EGT told us we were way out of line on temps, it might be all over. And during one of these runs, an EGT is not what I want to be looking at. After the run, the EGT pointer would be back on it's way down. For the moment, fuel seems to be the quickest fix. I am also interested in the intercooler ideas and who needs all that trunk space anyway. Thanks for the suggestions. The idea exchange is one of the great benefits of belonging to this group. Jim Griffin 93T ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Jan 1998 00:41:58 EST From: Daucott Subject: Re: MR2 mki distributor o-ring In a message dated 97-12-30 19:26:09 EST, synchris@ricochet.net writes: > Once upon a time I tried to change my distributor o-ring. The new ring > (there was no old one) would not fit in the groove in the distributor > shaft. The groove itself was actually way too big, but the groove was > mostly taken up with what looked like a black anodized washer, except > it didn't move *at all* so I guess it was part of the dizzy shaft. In > any case the o-ring did NOT fit in the remaining groove space, and slid > up the shaft upon installation. Is there a trick here? What am I missing? > Or maybe they sent the wrong part? (That same parts order had several > other parts too, which were all right.) > Chances are that the "black annodized washer" was the OLD o-ring! I've seen these so hard that they look just like that. The new o-ring is about 3mm thick and about 25mm in diameter (rough numbers). Dave A. daucott@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Jan 1998 00:44:50 EST From: Daucott Subject: Re: MR2 Mk1 potentiometer and thanks! In a message dated 97-12-30 22:39:38 EST, locaencabeza@hotmail.com writes: > I have another question. I was reading through the NOV/DEC 94' > issue of Grassroots motorsport magazine and it had budget hop ups for > MK1. In the 1,000 setup it said to hook up a pententiometer to the > temperature sensor. By doing this they said that it can be adjusted to > fool the computer into thinking the engine is cold and richening the > injectors. I'm sure some of you guys have read this. What is your > opinion about this and what is a pententiometer anyway. Also where is > the temp sensor located at? Also how do you adjust the Air flow meter? > Are these good mods? or bad ones? I'm curious. Sounds like easy mods > but how much extra power do they give you? > The best advice I can give you is to check my website for Dynoday 1 where I tried these mods. The temp sensor works for low end but hurts high end. The AFM mods will help overall if you actually need more fuel. Dave A. daucott@aol.com http://members.aol.com/daucott ------------------------------ End of mr2-digest V2 #55