mr2-digest Saturday, 30 December 1995 Volume 01 : Number 076 Upgrades for 91 NA boost colder charge / boost response MR2 SC mods Funny story about a headlight Re: 93's GRM Oil Filters Headlights My sad tale Once again, the spectacular MR2 parts sale! Rear Quarter Panels for an 85 Mk1 NA '91 Turbo purchased, thanks! RE: MkII Headlights MKI Wheel/Tyre Sizes general topics Returned mail: unknown mailer error 1 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: uunet!ix.netcom.com!yogi6 (Harvey ) Date: Fri, 29 Dec 1995 00:25:19 -0800 Subject: Upgrades for 91 NA I am new to the digest and would like to know of upgrades to the 91 NA engine. I already have the K&N filtercharger, and an exhaust kit on the way, but what about computer chips, ignition, etc. Please let me know of anything that will give me a little more power. Also, does anyone have info on performance clutches for the 91, if so e-mail me at yogi6@ix.netcom.com. All help will be appreciated. Thanks Andrew ------------------------------ From: uunet!aol.com!CybrRacn54 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 1995 11:53:44 -0500 Subject: boost In a message dated 95-12-29 01:15:22 EST, you write: >The other question is that the '91 seemed to loose all boost about halfway >through the testdrive. The saleslady was clueless ("Uhhhh, like what's a >wastegate?"). At first I felt boost kick in around 3000 rpm and noted that >the boost gauge was working, and then later on the boost gauge was totally >unresponsive and didn't really notice any boost from 3-6000 rpm. Also, >while sitting still and just revving the engine to 4-5000 rpm the gauge >still sat on the "-". Should the boost gauge show presssure while just >revving it? And is the boost that noticeable while driving, or was I just >imagining it the first few times? > >I'd love to hear what some of the Turbo owners have to say. If I can get a >satisfactory response from the dealer or helpful advice from list members, >I'd like to close the deal on the Turbo this weekend! :) > > there should be no boost at all during idle or high idle for that matter. Under normal driving conditions, the needle moves only when the engine is put under a load. When you say that boost disappears at 3-6K, are you still under load? Once you let off the throttle, boost drops quickly. Gerald San Agustin 88 Twincharger Cyber Racing, So Cal. ------------------------------ From: uunet!aol.com!CybrRacn54 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 1995 11:53:43 -0500 Subject: colder charge / boost response In a message dated 95-12-29 01:15:22 EST, you write: >Recently, some on this list have commented on the improved performance of >the turbo engine during cold weather. This would make sense since the >colder air is more dense, but my turbo seems to provide less boost and >slower spool-up during cold weather which causes performance to suffer. I >heard once that it is designed to provide less boost during cold >temperatures in order to prevent an overpressure condition. Can anyone >confirm this? first of all, turbos a run by exhaust energy (heat). When the exhaust charge is hot, for example - retarded timing or ideal air-fuel ratios, then the spool-up is quick. As for the 3SGTE motor, the only air tempertaure sensors is at the air flow meter and one besides the intercooler (external). The engine basically interpolates what charge is actually going into the motor. Now, when the outside temperature gets cold, the air temp sensors are seeing a cold charge. But intake charge gets affected by the heat soaked through the turbine and the air temperature rise due to pressurizing of the air. The ECU sends a richer signal to the injectors, but the charge is already quite hot. This in turn gives a slightly richer mixture, causing a cooling of the exhaust charge, causing a slight increase in turbo lag. Incidentally, all this is resolved if you upgrade to an HKS VPC. This unit incorporates an intake charge temperature sensor situated near the intake manifold. This in turn will sense ACTUAL intake temperature. Gerald San Agustin 88 Twincharger Cyber Racing, So Cal. ------------------------------ From: uunet!aol.com!CybrRacn54 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 1995 11:53:36 -0500 Subject: MR2 SC mods In a message dated 95-12-29 01:15:22 EST, you write: >Hey everyone I am fairly new to the aftermarket upgrading but last summer on >my SC MR2 I upgraded to HKS freeflow exhaust, powerflo air, Twin Power >Ignition, and oversized supercharger pulley. This was very expensive and I >was a little dissapointed. I am supposed to have 178 horses now. The mid >range acceleration is noticeable but nothing on the low end. What do I need >to do to get a little more oomph at the low end. I have heard everything from >change the computer to polish and port the head. I want a little more kick >but don't want to play to much with reliability. THANX. > > low end response was probably lost due to the bypassing of the supercharger VSV. This is necessary so that the ABV (air bypass valve) will not open when the boost is turned up to 10psi. I would suggest some sort of ignition amplifier, such as a Jacobs Energy Team or maybe an MSD unit. This should improve the bottom end somewhat and make the motor more responsive. by the way, if you do intend to polish and port the head, make sure it's a reputable shop. If the head is over-ported, you will lose a lot of bottom end due to loss of air velocity. I'm not sure about local shops near you, but try giving DPR (Dan Paramore Racing Heads) a call. He's been dealing with Toyota heads for a least 20 years now and has done the work for most of the TRD and IMSA race cars. Gerald San Agustin 88 Twincharger Cyber Racing, So Cal. ------------------------------ From: uunet!fyi.net!jsweaz Date: Fri, 29 Dec 95 14:00:53 PST Subject: Funny story about a headlight It was late in the evening and I had been driving around with a burned out headlight for a few days. I received a warning from a Pittsburgh Police Officer about the headlight and assured him that it would be replaced immediately. I purchased two units to replace both headlights. Let me remind you that in Pennsylvania it has been extremely snowy and cold. I had a few minutes to do the job at my parents home (no garage). My girlfriend stayed in the car as I braved the cold weather. The old light came out without a glitch. I put in the shiny new light, but didn't put the screws in, just in case the light was defective and didn't work. I instructed my girlfriend to switch the lights on, and I was happy that they worked no problem. I exclaimed "OK!...this will only take a minute more!" and click... she turned the headlight swich back one position too far and clunk! down went the covers. Well, needless to say when the units were popped up once again, to my dismay, the replaced shiny new headlight was no longer in place, but hanging beneath the brackets, suspended only by the cable. Well, let me just tell you right now that there is not an easy way to retrieve a headlight that has fallen to such a fate. I tried everything I could think of, but finally just unhooked the cable and decided to use the other headlight replacement. So currently I am driving around with three headlights... two operational and one that makes some interesting noises as it bounces around car's front end. jsweaz@fyi.net ------------------------------ From: uunet!aol.com!KipAnderso Date: Fri, 29 Dec 1995 16:00:23 -0500 Subject: Re: 93's >you might keep looking for a newer >turbo model; 93 was the first year of the new suspensions that's supposed to >be more able to handle the power. Aaaah, but it was really an adjustment on handling that you are referrring to. The 93s however were available with a limited slip differential and an extra shift synchro in the transaxle and the 91s were not. This does not necessarily mean that all 93s have them as I believe they were an option. As to whether or not the 91s are able to handle the power, it's more a question of "Is the driver able to effectively deal with the handling quirks?" The 93 is surely an improvement on both aspects, but a person can save close to $7000 just by going for a 91 (turbo). (For anybody that's wondering about all of the differences, be sure to check out the FAQ if you haven't already done so.) Kip Anderson 91 Turbo, non LSD :-( kca@interserv.com ------------------------------ From: Adam Grove Date: Fri, 29 Dec 1995 13:51:38 -0500 Subject: GRM Anyone who likes to read about the Mr2 might wish to pick up a copy of the latest (Jan/Feb) edition of "Grassroots Motorsports" magazine. To mark the (US) demise of the Mr2, they have an interesting and quite detailed article discussing the car's history. -Adam Grove (88 MkI SC) ------------------------------ From: uunet!getnet.com!doug (Doug Hutter) Date: Fri, 29 Dec 1995 16:30:50 -0701 (MST) Subject: Oil Filters I just picked up two Toyota filters at the dealer (for my '95 Turbo) They had the 90915-10002 number listed in the parts book. The box and the filter itself both show the number as 08922-02002 (as interchangeable with 90915-10002) and the FO-10 part number is on the box. Also says the application is 4A-G series, FA-FHE, 4A-FHE and 3S-GTE (except Celica ST165). Guess I'll learn whether or not it works when I change it tomorrow. ------------------------------ From: uunet!boulder.earthnet.net!mr2 (MR2 Performance Products) Date: Fri, 29 Dec 1995 14:00:42 -0700 Subject: Headlights I offer upgrade headlights for the MR2. Let me know if you would like an email catalog (about 14K long file). I also offer the finest brake pads for the MR2. Ask Marc Summers how well they work! Thanks, John Broderick Mr.2 Performance Products email: mr2@earthnet.net 1-800-4MR-2003 ------------------------------ From: uunet!arthor.cais.com!scott_maclean (Scott Maclean) Date: 29 Dec 1995 5:00 EST Subject: My sad tale Reply-To: scott_maclean@arthor.cais.com (Scott Maclean) Last Tuesday I was driving into work on I-270, and I smashed my 91 Turbo. I didn't remember what had actually happened until the next day, which is kind of scary. I was in the left hand lane driving normally with traffic (about 65 mph). There was a loud bang as my front left tire blew out, and the steering wheel jerked left in my hand. The car started to skid and go towards the shoulder, so I corrected by turning the wheel to the right, and as soon as I started to do this it spun to the right all the way, twisting my right arm, twisting and straining my elbow. At this point the car instantly started skidding the other direction, went sideways, and shot across the four lanes of traffic and into the wall on the right-hand side of the road, at a 45 degree angle, around 50 mph. I hit the wall three times (front left corner, rear left corner, then rear right corner), then spun back out into traffic, and was hit once more by another car. My beloved MR2 is utterly destroyed, but I walked away from it. They had to pry the door open to get me out. I'm pretty bruised and very sore, but no serious injuries. I smacked my head on the side window (and my hip on the armrest, which is what hurts most of all) on the first impact with the wall, and somehow my knee is hurt, my neck is a bit sore, and my hand is burned from where the airbag came out, but other than that I'm fine. The seatbelt saved my life, and the airbag kept me from getting whiplash, so I guess I'm pretty lucky. The airbag HURTS! It's like someone punching you in the face! But it worked and did it's job. My car is completely wrecked. I hit the wall three times, once on the front left corner, once on the left rear corner and then once again on the right rear corner, then spun back out into traffic where I got hit on the left rear side by another car before coming to rest sideways across two lanes. My laptop computer and my briefcase were in the trunk, and both were smashed. I don't remember what I had in the front trunk, but whatever it is, it's smashed as well. Anyway, that was my little Christmas surprise. It's been a wonderful holiday. :) I don't know what I'm going to do now...at least I have lots of insurance. One of the state troopers looked at what was left of my car and asked me: "Is it paid off?" I just looked at him and said, "well, it is now." :) Oh well. Life goes on. But I DID so love that car. I *WILL* buy another one. Another red one. :) :) Scott MacLean CASMEL-I Artificial Horizons BBS arthor@cais.com Aviation! (301) 417-9341 http://www.cais.com/arthor/www/index.html 300-33,600 bps V.FC/V.34+ * Free Access * Aviation Files * Usenet Newsgroups * CD-ROMs Online * ** Via PMail 2.3h Reg#658976 ------------------------------ From: uunet!aol.com!QUASICAM3 Date: Sat, 30 Dec 1995 14:39:57 -0500 Subject: Once again, the spectacular MR2 parts sale! Hi all, Just a reminder, I've got lots-o-parts from my parts car. A partial list is as follows: Hood, engine lid, trunk lid, taillights, instrument cluster, dashboard, interior door panels, complete electrical system, mostly complete suspension, motor/tranny, driveshafts, pass. seat, radiator, interior trim, exterior trim... lots more. Just e-mail with what you are looking for. I'm looking for recomendations on a good set of swaybars, struts and possibly springs for auto-x and summer time street driving. Or if you have something that you might want to sell or trade for something that I have, Please let me know!!! See ya. Chris ------------------------------ From: uunet!aol.com!ECNEPRADEL Date: Sat, 30 Dec 1995 18:34:39 -0500 Subject: Rear Quarter Panels for an 85 Mk1 NA Does anyone know of a supplier of rear quarter panels for an 85 Mk1NA. I've decided to replace them rather than go the bondo route. Any advice on whether to go Toyota or if I can get a knockoff that still has good quality steel? george ecnepradel@aol.com ------------------------------ From: uunet!coil.com!bigd (Dave Inskeep) Date: Sat, 30 Dec 1995 22:50:26 -0500 Subject: '91 Turbo purchased, thanks! I hope this isn't considered part of the "S" in the digest's S/N ratio, but I'd like to thank the folks who gave me advice to my post from this past Thursday. To summarize the responses, the boost gauge won't show much in 1st, 2nd or 3rd, and certainly not while revving in neutral. The test that works is to bang it in 4th or 5th around 35-45 mph and it should show up to full boost. I performed this test yesterday and it passed, so I bought the car--picked it up today!! Just in case, I bought the extended warranty (yes, I have "sucker" stamped on my forehead, it's quite visible!) For those who are wondering, I paid $11,000 for a '91-T with sunroof, 3-in-1 stereo, and without driving lights, 44k miles. Again, thanks to those who replied, I love the car! Dave Inskeep P.S. Sorry for the inappriate posting method of my original post, I checked my original majordomo notice and hopefully this will go through the right channels! - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "640K ought to be enough for anybody." -- Bill Gates, 1981 - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.coil.com/~bigd/ ------------------------------ From: "Thomas Michael Worrell" Date: 27 Dec 95 20:41:42 -0800 Subject: RE: MkII Headlights >Like some of you on this list, I find the MkII's headlights to be anemic and >would like to change out to much higher than the US stock 65/35 watt sealed beam >units...but... Find a pair of Hella H4's. They are great lights. As soon as one of my 93 headlights goes, I am getting some H4's for replacements. The default wattage is 65/55 (me thinks), and you can get replacement bulbs up to 100/80. Also, if one burns out, you simply replace the bulb. I had these lights on my 85 Prelude (which I sold for the 93 MR2). The light pattern of these lights has a VERY pronounced cutoff, which is horizontal, changing to a sharp upturn on the right. The only problem, on cars with tight suspensions, is that as the car moves up and down over the road, oncoming traffic may go from being above the cutoff to below the cutoff, which make it look like you are flashing your high beams. H4's used to be for "off road use only", but I think that they are now street legal in the US. If they are still not legal, you never heard about them from me. :-) Tom. ===================================================================== Thomas Michael Worrell TWorrell@us.oracle.com Oracle Corporation TWorrell@msn.com 500 Oracle Parkway 75347.2247@compuserve.com Mailstop 659408 415-506-2773 Work Redwood Shores, CA 94065 415-506-7224 Fax ------------------------------ From: Kevin Startup Date: Fri, 29 Dec 95 09:17:25 -0800 Subject: MKI Wheel/Tyre Sizes I am shortly going to change the wheel sizes on my MK I. Please can someone tell me what the maximum size I can go to is. I had in mind 7x16 wheels fitted with 215/45R16 tyres .... Is this right? Or is 205 the maximum size and should I be looking for 40 wall height? Please advise ... mail direct: kes@mfltd.co.uk ... or to the list Thanks Kevin ------------------------------ From: uunet!ix.netcom.com!mikl (Michael A. Lavey ) Date: Sat, 30 Dec 1995 09:48:27 -0800 Subject: general topics I am interested in general MR2 topics. I have a 1995 non-turbo and would like to hear people's experiences with performance parts, after market wheels and any other tricks that improve the performance or looks of MR2's. ------------------------------ From: Mailer-Daemon (Mail Delivery Subsystem) Date: Fri, 29 Dec 95 19:21:13 PST Subject: Returned mail: unknown mailer error 1 ----- Transcript of session follows ----- sh: fork failed - too many processes 554 "| /home/validgh/major/home/wrapper archive2.pl -f /home/validgh/major/lists/mr2.archive/mr2 -m -a"... unknown mailer error 1 sh: fork failed - too many processes 554 "| /home/validgh/major/home/wrapper digest -r -C -l mr2-digest mr2-digest-outgoing"... unknown mailer error 1 ----- Unsent message follows ----- Return-Path: Received: by validgh.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA29672; Fri, 29 Dec 95 19:21:13 PST Errors-To: "|/usr/ucb/vacation dgh", \dgh Received: from uunet.UUCP by validgh.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA29551; Fri, 29 Dec 95 19:14:50 PST From: uunet!aol.com!CybrRacn54 Received: from mail04.mail.aol.com by relay2.UU.NET with SMTP id QQzwfr20646; Fri, 29 Dec 1995 11:53:41 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail04.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA29464 for validgh!mr2-digest@uunet.uu.net; Fri, 29 Dec 1995 11:53:41 -0500 Date: Fri, 29 Dec 1995 11:53:41 -0500 Message-Id: <951229115340_26503512@mail04.mail.aol.com> To: uunet!validgh!mr2-digest Subject: blow off valves Sender: owner-mr2 Precedence: bulk In a message dated 95-12-29 01:15:22 EST, you write: >So another question for you experienced guys. I'm considering an HKS EVC III >to raise the boost a bit, probably only consistantly to the factory max of >11.8 for now. Do I need one of these adjustable pop-off valves or an HKS >blow off valve? I see there are three types, standard, race and Super blow >off valves. What makes sense for my commuter rig that I occasionally run on >track days??? > > for boost pressures of that amount, the factory compressor bypass valve is plenty sufficient. One warning, if you do upgrade, make sure you plumb the bypass discharge back into the turbo. Unless you are using a VPC, you will confuse the air-flow meter if you bleed that boost out to atmosphere when you shift. Also, if the spring is soft enough, you might have that valve open under idle, which will disrupt the signal to the air-flow meter. Gerald San Agustin 88 Twincharger Cyber Racing, So Cal. ------------------------------ End of mr2-digest V1 #76